Episode 217 with Jeff Sharlet, Author of The Undertow: Scenes from a Slow Civil War, and Sharp-Eyed Chronicler of Impending Fascism and Previous Fighters in The Movements

Notes and Links to Jeff Sharlet’s Work

 

   For Episode 217, Pete welcomes Jeff Sharlet, and the two discuss, among other topics, his father and uncle’s outsized influence on Jeff’s reading and activism, allegory and worldbuilding and their roles in right -wing movements and propagandizing, incredibly-bleak and bright indications of the future, his reasoning in bookending the book with stalwarts in justice movements, the slow, creeping fascism that he charts through the book, and examples of and reason for steadfast activism.  

   Jeffrey Sharlet is New York Times/national bestselling author of THE FAMILY and C STREET. He is also  executive producer of the 2019 Netflix documentary series based on the work, with the documentary also called, THE FAMILY. His newest book is THE UNDERTOW: Scenes from a Slow Civil War. Sharlet is the Frederick Sessions Beebe '35 Professor in the Art of Writing at Dartmouth College.]

 

 

Buy The Undertow

 

Jeff's Website at Dartmouth College

 

Jeff’s Wikipedia Page

 

Review of The Undertow by Joseph O’Neill for The New York Times

 

At about 2:30, Jeff drops some about the history of his endowed chair and the origins of his workplace, Dartmouth College, including Samson Occom’s role

 

At about 5:10, Jeff talks about his early reading and fascinations and how the worldbuilding he loved and now informs his interests in the world building of the Far Right

 

At about 7:50, Jeff traces some of his family history, and how his father and Uncle Jeff’s amazing lives inform his own

 

At about 11:00, Jeff notes the mass-scale mutiny of US soldiers that ended the Vietnam War and connects to today’s fascist movements; he calls attention to underground movements of today and yesterday

 

At about 14:30, Jeff responds to Pete’s questions about his interest in and history with literature and films dealing with the Vietnam War

 

At about 17:20, Jeff responds to Pete’s questions about the ways in which The Vietnam War has been covered and propagandized in the resultant decades, “redefining the Vietnam story” and being embraced by many on the Far Right

 

At about 22:00, Jeff connects common tropes regarding veterans to Ashli Babbitt’s story, which is traced in much of his book The Undertow

 

At about 26:15, Jeff describes the ways in which interview subjects view the idea and possibilities for “civil war”

 

At about 28:15, Jeff discusses places to buy book and shouts out the library as a great place to rebel against impending book bans

 

At about 31:15, Jeff notes polls and surveys and how a Trump victory has informed his book and how to “tell stories about fascism” 

 

At about 34:50, Jeff talks about the term “Trumpism” and how there were “parameters of Reaganism” from 1980-2016 that gave way to the “Trumpocene” from 2016 to present   

 

At about 36:20, Jeff references ugly examples of Trumpism enabled and supported in policy

 

At about 38:10, Jeff shares information from protests in Sacramento that informed his book 

 

At about 39:30, Pete and Jeff discuss the way in which Jeff’s book is bookended by stories involving Harry Bellafonte and Lee Hays, and Jeff discusses why he started and ended the book with the songs and histories that he did 

 

At about 44:10, Jeff recounts the anecdote from the book about a dynamic and legendary hour program that Harry Bellafonte produced in 1959

 

At about 48:55, Pete notes his piqued interest in Lead Belly and his connection to Kurt Cobain

 

At about 50:55, Jeff talks about “challenging” American figures who have often been “smoothed out,” such as Leadbelly

 

At about 52:10, Jeff gives background on how the last line of the book came about 

 

At about 54:10, Jeff describes “safe spaces” in connection to an anecdote about activist Suzanne Pharr

 

At about 56:05, Pete notes a dynamic photo in the book, and Jeff traces the story and his travels in Wisconsin that led to the photo

 

At about 1:02:05, Pete asks a question that has mystified him for years, re: MAGA “Merch”

 

At about 1:04:30, Pete compliments Jeff’s nuanced writing regarding young and not-so-young who are on the frontlines

 

At about 1:05:40, Pete notes the teaching of Things Fall Apart in his classes and Jeff shares his experience with the book

 

 

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   Please tune in for Episode 218 with Melissa Rivero. She is the author of The Affairs of the Falcons and the recently-published novel, Flores and Miss Paula. Melissa won the 2019 New American Voices Award, a 2020 International Latino Book Award, and was longlisted for PEN/Hemingway Award for Debut Novel.

   The episode will air on January 2.